The Contestants |
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The Breakdown |
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Advantages
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Disadvantages
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Kills
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How we think the fight will go
Jardir stood at the center of the small ring, spear slung over his shoulder, all confidence, waiting for his opponent to show itself. A small figure appeared, blue shawl wrapped loosely about her shoulders.
“A woman,” Jardir mumbled, a smug loo—
*Balefire*
Jardir ceased to exist, torn from the pattern as though he had never been born. Without even pausing, Moiraine walked through the ring and exited the other side, barely looking at the spot where her opponent had waited.
Just kidding…
Jardir sat cross legged under the lee of a crumbling stone wall. The ephemeral magic of the core swirled seductively around him, filling the night with its soft magic, its sensual touch trailing over his ward-covered skin. Those wards, the source of his power, absorbed the magic, soaking it in and letting it work at healing his wounds. His spear rested across his knees, its own wards untouched by the magic. Jardir could draw on the power of that spear, absorbing its innate power, but only as a last resort. The night was quiet and his opponent dead, he was in no rush; and the spear was not made for healing men, but for killing demons.
The spear had done its job against his previous opponent, killing the demon, but at great cost. For a reason he could not discern the metal demon he had fought had given no power to the spear.
A metal demon? Jardir mused the idea over in his mind. Through his years battling demons, Jardir had never encountered a metal demon, had not even known that they existed. And that rider upon its back? What kind of man would so wholly give himself to the servants of Nie, the anti-creator and Mother of demons. The Abyss had many secrets.
He bathed in the core’s magic, letting its power knit his flesh back together, healing the grievous wounds inflicted by his past foe. And what challenge awaited? What beast would he next face, either man or demon?
Jardir did not know where he was, precisely. His surroundings were unfamiliar and the ring of stones he leaned against looked to have been abandoned for hundreds of years. He appeared to be on the surface, but perhaps Nie’s Abyss would feel so, with a ceiling so high it appeared to be the night sky full of stars. Thrust into an alien world, he was pitted against such strange foes. Is this some test from the great Deliverer Kaji, he wondered, stroking an idle thumb along the shaft of his staff, feeling the rough texture of the carved runes. Kaji had walked through the seven layers of the Abyss to win Sharak Ka, the final war with the demons. Was this his own sojourn? The final leg in proving that it was he who was prophesied to defeat the demons for good?
A figure appeared just outside the ring of stones, a silhouette against the night’s shadows. Another foe? Or for once a friend? “I have no wish to fight you,” Jardir said. “All men are brothers in the night.”
“But I am not a man,” said the figure. Moonlight and the Abyss’ magic bathed the figure in light as it stepped from the shadows. A small woman, no higher than Jardir’s shoulder, but with her nose turned so high in the air that he couldn’t help smirking. She was wrapped in a dark shawl, trimmed in blue and a small gem sat suspended in the middle of her forehead. Her face was smooth and ageless, so full of confidence that it passed into the realm of arrogance.
“And I suppose I must fight you, for I am in the Abyss, where men must kill women instead of protecting them.”
“Abyss or no, I don’t know where I am, but you will not keep me from returning to the Dragon’s side before the last battle. No darkfriend will stand in my way after so long in captivity.”
Darkfriend? Jardir tried to refute the name, but was forced to leap aside as a blast of fiery magic shot from the diminutive woman’s hands.
Drawing on the source, Moiraine wove more fire and launched it at her foe. To use the source as a weapon against anyone but a Darkfriend was an offense against the Oaths she had sworn when she became Aes Sedai. But magic swirled around this man, and those runes painting his skin were certainly no work of the Creator.
With amazing speed, her dark-skinned foe leapt from his seated position, vaulted backwards over the stone wall. Still, the bolts of fire clipped him, but instead of enveloping him, melting his skin and killing him on the spot, the runes on his skin flared, absorbing the magic and leaving him unharmed.
Ahh, a dama’ting, Jardir thought; or this world’s equivalent. “At least this will be a fair fight,” he growled from behind the protection of the stone wall. Giving the woman no time to prepare, Jardir leapt back over the wall, launching his own attack at her, spear thrust before him. With otherworldly speed he was on the woman, blade aimed straight for her throat. It hit an invisible shield of air before reaching her, penetrating the magic barrier, but deflected and slowed enough that it missed the woman by just a hair.
In just her opponent’s near instantaneous pause of surprise, Moiraine wove earth and air, and struck at Jardir with a blunt hammer of saidar. At the same time, three rings of razor-sharp air appeared in her hand. She flung the rings at her opponent as he tumbled across the ground.
Jardir recovered from the assault in mid-air, landing lithely on his feet, spear drawn protectively before him. More fire blasted into the spear, absorbed by its wards. He drew a ragged breath. Blood trickled from a cut above his eye, obscuring his vision. Jardir flew at the woman, forcing her back with his spear. One strike hit home, piercing the woman’s shoulder. She stumbled away, clutching her useless arm. Another invisible fist slammed into Jardir and forced him to the ground. Tighter and tighter it grew, wrapping around his chest and squeezing the air out of his lungs. The sharp crack of breaking ribs was clear in the silent night.
“Do it, servant of the dark! Kill me and damn the world!” he snarled through gritted teeth.
Moiraine paused at his words, the weave of air holding him tight but no longer strengthening its grip. Servant of the dark? Who was this man. Despite the wards on his skin, Moiraine heard truth in his words. Damn the world? She remembered her last fights and those worlds she had found herself in, with their own demons and their own saviors. If these other worlds existed, do they each not require their own Dragon? Can she damn this world by killing its own Dragon Reborn? Just to save herself?
But there was a boy in her own world that needed her. The Dragon Reborn. Rand al’Thor.
In the time she had been away, Rand had surrounded him with an army of Aes Sedai and other ta’veren, each one dedicated to the fight against the Dark Lord, each one given over completely to Rand al’Thor. With asha’man at his side, Perrin and Matrim, too, what was one more Aes Sedai to the Dragon Reborn?
I was always ready to die to save the world, Moiraine thought. Ready to sacrifice all to defeat the Dark Lord. But does it matter which one?
Yes, she decided. It does matter. She tightened the weave of air around her struggling opponent. Then it dissipated. Frantically, she tried to weave another hammer of air, but she could not. Panic started to creep through her calm, cracks appearing in her iron will. The True Source filled Moiraine to bursting, but she could no longer weave anything to harm her opponent. The True Source pushed against her Oath.
He named me “servant of the dark” she realized, stunned. No darkfriend would curse me with that name on the brink of death. He walks in the light. Bound by the Oath Rod, she could harm no man who was not a Darkfriend.
The weight of her magic no longer crushing him into the ground, Jardir gathered his strength and with one final thrust of will, he gathered his feet under himself, and leapt viciously at Moiraine. The tip of his warded spear drove into the small woman’s throat.
Jardir caught her before she fell to the ground, gathered her in his arms. He recognized then, in the glint of dying light behind her dark eyes, that she was no demon, that she fought against the same evils as he. “What have I done?” he whispered to the night, watching the light fade from her.
Special thanks to Aidan Moher from A Dribble of Ink, who collaborated with Peter V. Brett to write up this Cage Match
Predicted Winner: Jardir
NOTE: THIS MATCH ENDS ON THURSDAY, MARCH 22nd, 2012, AT 5 PM, EST
Check out the previous match from the Miskatonic University Field House bracket!
Moiraine Damodred is a character from the Wheel of Time series by Robert Jordan; Jardir is a character from the Demon Cycle series by Peter V. Brett
Moiraine image courtesy of Jason Chan and Tor Books. Jardir image courtesy of Larry Rostant and Del Rey Books
Don’t forget–we’re always looking for fans’ depictions of these characters. Check out the details here
Cage Match fans: We are looking forward to hearing your responses! If possible, please abstain from including potential spoilers about the books in your comments (and if you need spoilers to make your case, start your comments with: “SPOILER ALERT!”
Thanks!
He was trying to kill her. If she felt in danger, she could do whatever she wanted under the three oaths.
Aes Sedi can kill people who aren’t dark friends. MORAINE HERSELF has killed men who weren’t Dark Friends. They just can’t do it unless they, their warder or another Aes Sedi is in physical danger (or really just if she believes they are).
The three oaths:
To speak no word that is not true
To make no weapon with which one man may kill another
Never to use the One Power as a weapon except against Darkfriends or Shadowspawn, or in the last extreme defense of her life, the life of her Warder or another Aes Sedai
So, in a nutshell… what Leaken said.
Maybe one day suvudu will be able to find someone to do the write up for the match, who has read WOT and understands how the rules work.
Despite the presence of the moral dilemma, the Three Oaths state that an Aes Sedai may use the Power as a weapon in self-defense. It would be hard for her, but she would be able to at least subdue him and try to convince him, “Hey, you know what? We’re on the same side!
Why were we fighting again?”
Even if Jardir’s wards offered protection against the One Power, it wouldn’t matter. Moiraine could explode the ground under his feet, or pull all of the air out of his surroundings and leave him to suffocate, or left a boulder right over his head and drop it, or some equally indirect attack that would kill him instantly.
And the issue of the Three Oaths has already been touched upon.
Yeah, Let’s just remember these comments about the ‘rules’ when they DON’T favor the WoT characters… I’ve seen this before where the the ‘rules’ are conveniently twisted and /or ignored when such action would benefit the WoT character…
@Suvudu
if it isn’t too much trouble try to read the series before u actually do a write up…
Aes Sedai can kill and use one power as a weapon when their or their Warder’s life is in danger…
and in a TO DEATH Cage Match it is pretty obvious that her life is IN DANGER….since it is a MORTAL BATTLE…so there is no way she would loose…
If you read the write up; she attacked him. Therefore, she violated the rules. So you are all, in fact, incorrect. He was seated, not posing any threat and she attacked. Not self defense, and a clear violation of the rules. Her power would have failed her right then, and it would be over.
MORAINE FTW!!!!!!!!!!!! THEY MESSED IT UP WHEN THEY GOT TO THE PART WHERE THEY SAID………\JUST KIDDING\
I found the balfire gag really funny but to wipeout 30 years of a man’s life the balefire would probably destroy the universe. The maximum moraine would be able to do even with an angreal would be a couple of minute to an hour.
Also I have to agree with the others Moraine would have been able to defend herself but the moral choise was a nice touch. For the winner of this fight I can say because I don’t know the othe caracter here but if his spear can pierce an air shield and can’t be destroyed(?) Moraine would be in trouble.
Reciprocity I think you’re right in saying that she couldn’t have attacked first if she wasn’t in danger but the 3 oaths work with what a person believes and not actual fact. If she could convice herself he was evil or a threat she could attack first and in the writeup they both seem to be coming from their previous fight so it’s easy to assume the next person you meet will also be an enemy.
Philippe
Then everybody is still wrong, because as soon as she heard him call her a dark servant, her belief was wrong, and would have been wrong from the beginning. I don’t think the write up did a bad job. Because honestly, in this situation neither of the characters would have had anything other than their natural, physical powers. Jardir’s demon wards wouldn’t be working, and Moiraine would not have been able to use One power against him either. It then would have come down to a hand to hand battle, which Jardir would have dominated.
@reciprocity
Moiraine would drop a boulder on him, like a previous poster said. And she’s allowed to defend herself if she’s getting attacked. At the first she figured he was a darkfriend, then he was started trying to kill her
@Reciprocity
That’s just it. It DOESN”T matter whether or not someone is or is not a Darkfriend. All that matters is whether or not the Aes Sedi believes that she herself, her warder, or another Aes Sedi is in danger. If on the other hand an Aes Sedi knows (or thinks she knows) that a person is a Darkfriend or shadow spawn, then she doesn’t even have to feel like she’s in danger.
The purpose of the oath was to give Aes Sedi plenty of leeway to defend themselves while conveying to the public that they weren’t going to start randomly blowing people up in fits of megalomania.
That oath wouldn’t come into play in this match up at all unless Jardir flat out refused to harm her in any way and made that clear before she had the chance to think he was in danger and attack him.
I’m not saying that she would necessarily win this fight. I’m just saying that the oath doesn’t work the way the write up makes it sound like it does.
@ Reciprocity
Initially she believed him to be a darkfriend and was able to attack. When that was proven to be untrue, she could still use it for defense. A bubble of Air around him would have effectively rendered him useless. It would ultimately be a stalemate. Unless, of course, she still considered him to be threatening her life and then she kills him easily.
Even if Moiraine couldn’t initially use the One Power on Jardir and didn’t consider him a darkfriend or herself in danger, Jardir would not be able to win this fight without attacking her in some way. Ergo, as soon as he makes his first move, he’s dead. Even if he doesn’t, Moiraine can still disable him non-lethally like she did to Tarzan and end the battle that way.
?”In the time she had been away, Rand had surrounded him with an army of Aes Sedai and other ta’veren, each one dedicated to the fight against the Dark Lord, each one given over completely to Rand al’Thor.”
OMG, no people. We are not in Harry Potter world. He is called the Dark One, not the Dark Lord. And Darkfriends call him the Great Lord, or Great Lord of the Dark. Who wrote this match? >.>
At least they didn’t have her using her blue stone as an angreal again. That was just sad.
I voted for Moiraine because I don’t really know Jadir at all. Although, I am kind of interested in reading his series now. : )
I agree with the first part of the write-up.
Oh, and by the way, I’m bringing back something from the first ever cagematch.
BALEFIRE, BITCHES!
Jk, just mentioning it. Not going to say it anymore.
I guess if you guys are going to grasp at straws here, then it’s only fair to say that Jardir’s wards are able to absorb/ counter her magic as well. Therefore, rendering her magic useless and again; laying the fight out to hand to hand. Which again, Jardir would/ did dominate.
BEST WRITE-UP YET! The Balefire joke was so funny! I’m still laughing! Go Jardir!
@Reciprocity
I have read both series and I believe Moraine would win. The warded man might have a chance but Jardir would most likely lose.
The three oaths would not be an issue.
The magic immunity would stop her from using direct attacks.
The Magic in Wheel of time though is very versatile and she would not need to use is to directly attack him. Also she would be able to see what happens to her weaves and could very quickly change strategy. Often times indirectly attacking with magic is the best way to kill someone any way. Whether she kills him with a rock slide or throws something big and heavy at him she has many many weapons that she can use all of which can be lethal to him.
Now he is deadly but unless he manages to get close to her fast she makes this a quick kill.
Moiraine only has to FEEL threatend to use the One Power as a weapon, and I’m pretty sure Jardir’s wards couldn’t stand up to BALEFIRE. Besides, she though he was a Darkfreind in the begining, and therefor could attack him. After that, her life was in danger, so she could BALEFIRE him out of existance, like what happened in the beginning.
Well, Jardir’s breakdown says that his wards only protect against magical fire… But, even if that’s wrong and they counter ANY magic used against him, Moiraine could simply explode the ground under his feet, trap him in bonds of air, or pick up something and smash him with it.
This has the one-sidedness of magic user vs non-magic user. It doesn’t mean Jardir couldn’t win… just that he probably wouldn’t. Oath technicalities aside, I enjoyed the write up. I’ll have to check out The Demon Cycle.
Honestly, is it really so hard to get a single hardcore fan of each book involved in a cage match to proof read the write up before posting? For my fellow WoT fans … don’t let the glaring inaccuracies in this write up put you off. I haven’t read The Desert Spear yet, but I can vouch for The Warded/Painted Man. It’s a fantastic start to the series.
@ Jam, the trouble is that this happens EVERY TIME, its like they are trying to ensure that Moiraine and every other powerful character loses (seriously, go hear what they said about a Bast/Zaphod matchup, in a rather clear attempt to kick Rake out of this).
*Light Spoilers*
As Mat’s Medallion proves, the One power can be used in plenty of indirect ways to kill you. Even lightning is considered an indirect weave (That is, there is no more magic involved after the bolt is created, ergo it can bypass anti-magic wards), She could simply trap him in a wall of air, or tear the ground out from under him, or hit him with lightning, or any of a thousand things even if her weaves can’t touch him.
*Bigger spoiler*
Heck, the way the Gholam was finally stopped was a pretty impressive one of those.
Dama ‘ting my ass dude. You wish she was one of those weak ass bitches. Moiraine will wipe the floor with this back stabbing, spear stealing piece of shit. This guy has no honor, as proven by the way he did Arlen. I doubt Moiraine would even break a sweat. Spear of blah blah – poof – over.
I’m a big fan of both series, and while Wot is my favorite the demon cycle is certainly one of the better series I’ve read recently. within those series I’m not a huge fan of either Moraine or Jardir but they are both great characters and powerful in their own way, however Moraine has a clear advantage, unless Jardir got in close real fast and made the first move i can’t see him winning, and as soon as the fight began Moraine certainly wouldn’t let him in close, she knows her weaknesses, personally i think she’d bind him up in air and force him to surrender, or tie of the weaves, set them to unravel after a while, and walk away.
@Chris
*********SPOILER*********************
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Actually, the lightning bit was because it was from Ravhin. The medalion only protects from Saidar, and not Saidin.
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That being said, there are many ways to indirectly attack with magic. Like removing all the oxygen from the air, or drawing all the heat out of an area, or dropping a mountain (alright, large boulder) on someones head. So Moiraine wins.
@Chandran
We have no proof that it only protects from Saidar but we DO have proof that lighting is indirect.
Yes Mat THOUGHT that it could have been a vulnerability to Saidin in The Fires of Heaven, but earlier we have a though of Egwene when she and Elayne were visiting a storage room
She said that she had readied a weave for lightning–then goes on to think for herself that it was actually a weave that created the conditions for lightnign–a bit of plot expose’
Mat thining that Saidin can work on his medallion does not make it true.
Sorry my bad AFTER fires of Heaven when he thinks back on his death therein
@Chandran
******SPOILER******
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Mat was not affected by Hamila’s channeling (Saidin) when he/she was around. Rahvin’s lightning was an indirect kill which caused him to die before being Balefired back. Rahvin had set a ward to trigger lightening strikes wherever people hit them. The Medalion does protect from Saidin; it seems to protect against any weave directly aimed at the wearer. More info here: http://www.steelypips.org/wot-tgs/node/101.html
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And as others have pointed out, there are a LOT of indirect ways to kill in the series. while Jadir’s protections help against the direct, the Power in WoT was designed to counter such things.
Moiraine wouldn’t have had problems with the oaths if 1) she thought he was a darkfriend or darkspawn, 2) she thought her life was in danger or 3) if she wasn’t using the One Power as a weapon. It doesn’t make sense for the bonds of air to dissolve even if either of the first conditions weren’t true. Throughout the series Aes Sedai are clearly able to flick/lash (in punishment) or bind or gag people with air even if as they don’t view it as using it as a weapon. They can use the One Power on people, they’re just bound not to use it as a weapon, and before people try to justify that air lashes or binding are weapons its demonstrated clearly whenever Aes Sedai are present in the series that they clearly don’t consider them to be weapons. They seem to only regard using the One Power to maim or kill as a weapon. Binding, Healing, gagging, compulsion, even physical punishment isn’t viewed that way. So with Jadir bound and not a threat, Moiraine may not have been able to kill him with the Power (unless she felt sure her life was still in danger), but she’d certainly be able to keep him bound indefinitely. And there’s no oath preventing an Aes Sedai from killing a person conventionally.
And as has been said, even if he can absorb magic, she can easily pick up rocks or cause and earthquake or a massive difference in voltage around him (to cause a lightning strike, not lightning made of the One Power but real electricity, they don’t specifically talk about voltage or potential but it’s made clear that they can make lightning happen, not just make lightning), so once she realizes certain methods of attack melt away (and as they can see their magic weaves in real space and would see them dissipate or absorb into something) she’d probably figure this out fairly quickly.
This isn’t even one of the finer points in the series as its consistently brought up, it just shows a clear lack of knowledge of anything WoT.
One final addendum. As has been said, the Oaths work not with fact but just with what the Aes Sedai believes. If she believes someone to be a darkfriend or darkspawn, she can use the One Power (OP) as a weapon. If she believes her life is in danger, she can use the OP as a weapon. Aes Sedai are forbidden from speaking no word that isn’t true, however they can speak words they honestly believe are true at the moment (even if it is in fact false). They’re also not forbidden from lying, just speaking no word that isn’t true. They can imply falsehoods and lead people into them all they want. Want to hide your name? Don’t say “My name is ____” say “You may call me _____” Just an example.
Final point is that oaths have no retroactive effect. If an Aes Sedai says something they believe to be true only to find out later that it was false, there’s no negative effect. Same would go with using the One Power as a weapon. The oaths only hold them in the present.
Moraine all the way. Jardir should’ve been finished off in the first match as the comments there pointed out. Even if he managed to get through that one, the second match would’ve done him in, as the comments there pointed out. So, he should’ve been gone a long time ago. Therefore, I think the second part of this write-up should be deleted. Balefire, bitches! Then, the matches could’ve continued the way they should’ve in the first place: with Jardir dead before the end of the first round. Apart from this, since this is the match we have, and as has been pointed out in the comments above, Moraine would still win.
On a side note, if not for Phil pointing out the story is good despite Jardir, I’d have even less interest in this series. The premise doesn’t sound interesting, especially if Jardir is the main protagonist. As it is, I still may not be interested. There are plenty of other, better sounding books.
I’m trying to decide who to vote for here, and I just have one question for you people who have read the Demon Cycle series with Jardir before I vote for him… Has he ever been stuffed into a sack (literally) by a group of random goons? Because Moraine has… Just Sayin…
A group of random goons.. Jardir would not break a sweat killing any group of… random goons.
I would love to see Arlen against her… It would be a no contest… Moraine would lose. Just like Beowolf should of lost.
@Archon:
*spoilers for WOT*
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Rand, a character from the WoT on a demiGod level at that point was captured by 13 “random goon Aes Sedai” nearly all of whom where later killed when he escaped (with serious help). Ohh, and Rand was able to kill two warders (effectively, the best of the best bodyguards) with his bare hands the first time he managed to escape.
In other words, because of the way WoT books are written, even the most powerful character can, for a time, find themselves at the mercy of a one off character who will likely be dead in a few chapters. A channeler, as long as they know a threat exists, is pretty much unstoppable except by serious use of magic. (Jardir, as strong as he may be, is simply a poor match against Moiraine, the OP is well suited for dealing with anyone who can’t use it).
Agree with most of what is said previously – shocking lack of knowledge of WoT and its rules. Get a fan (or at least someone who has read) each book(s) to proof all of these – just not that hard. Nothing in that would have prevented Moiraine from defending herself. She’s plenty smart and battle-wise to get around his wards. She’s defeated tougher – repeatedly. She’d win, hands down.
And just because the guy calls Moiraine a Darkfriend (essentially) doesn’t mean HE’s not a servant of the dark himself. Ummm – y’know, evil people have been known to lie. A lot. Duh